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GUE or TDI, Decisions Decisions

Discussion in 'Technical Diving' started by bigtangonovember, May 28, 2010.

  1. bigtangonovember

    bigtangonovember New Member

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    Hi all,

    Come to the point where i want to get into technical diving. Have looked at most of the agencies that train for technical diving and looking very seriously at either TDI or GUE.
    GUE certainly looks more in depth which i like the sound of, although TDI seem to be recognized all around the world (i do travel and dive a lot around the world).
    I am an avid wreck diver and have been looking at the TDI advanced wreck, GUE don't offer any wreck stuff yet which is a shame.

    Can anyone advise on the route i should maybe take? Or have any other opinions?

    Thanks for your help!
     
  2. Phil O

    Phil O Member

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    I'm not going to advise but will happily give an opinion. I have trained with a number of agencies starting with PADI before going to the GUE Fundies and GUE Tech 1 but have also done courses with a NAUI instructor and PSA (Martyn Farr for UK cave diving).

    I honestly think that when you start to consider technical diving the key thing to consider is the quality of instructor. I've not done a specific wreck diving course (shock horror) but am happy to dive in wrecks following training given in GUE courses, or a NAUI course with the legendary Andrew Georgitsis.

    I don't know (or at least I think I don't know) any TDI instructors but would happily recommend a number of GUE instructors. There are also some shit hot IANTD instructors.
     
  3. MK_Stu

    MK_Stu Member

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    The agencies are not mutually exclusive. I have trained with GUE and IANTD and would recommend both. If you are going to train with GUE you need to decide if you are committed to DIR diving and adopting a DIR kit configuration.

    The TDI wreck course is not an introductory tech course but TDI and IANTD have intro course - IANTD - Advanced Rec Trimix, TDI Advanced Nitrox and deco procedures and/or their new triox course.

    There are great instructors with IANTD, TDI and GUE: GUE is a different proposition and I would recommend talking to a GUE instructor about the factors that are unique to GUE. The GUE route will take longer - you need to do fundamentals (a four day course) before Tech 1: but I think it is worth every minute. Contact Clare Gledhill, John Kendall or Rich Walker through Yorkshire Divers or www.direxplorers.com.

    I did my IANTD course with Howard Payne who is an excellent instructor and very experienced GUE diver. He is based with Dive Wimbledon which is a long way from Wisbech but teaches ART and Normoxic in Malta. Howard is a good guy to talk to about the various pros and cons of GUE as compared to TDI/IANTD and I am sure would be happy to talk through the options on the phone. Stuart Keasley (Bottlefish) on this site is also an excellent IANTD instructor and for TDI there is Mark Powell (Howard, Stuart and Mark can all be contacted through Yorkshire Divers).

    I have telephone numbers for all of the above instructors so pm me if you want them.
     
  4. Major Clanger

    Major Clanger P-Plated Meg Diver

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    Personally I wouldn't look for a good instructor or choose an agency until I knew what I was aiming for. Work out what you want to do and why, investigate the agency that provides the closest training and then seek advice about good instructors. Sounds obvious but get the right training for the type of diving you want to do.

    Compare similar courses with different agencies and you'll see the differences with the end qualification in terms of depth, skills covered, deco time etc. After a lot of investigation I'm going down the Adv nitrox/deco route with TDI. Originally, I was looking at doing Trimix but decided against it at this stage on grounds of costs and how often I'd use it. For me and the type of diving I want to do, the TDI route offers a good overall entry qual in to tech diving (unlimited deco/up to 100% O2 deco gas/45m range/and up to 40% O2 bottom gas/twinset and self-reliance skills training) but it took quite a bit of research and deliberation before I came to this conclusion and had to make some compromises.

    You mention going straight to advanced wreck diving. Be cautious of running before walking. You don't need any tech diver quals to do the TDI advanced wreck course (advanced sports diver with 50 logged dives). However, my advice would be to do an entry level tech course first , in order to gain the most out of the advanced wreck course if done afterwards. The advanced wreck course is restricted by the level of training held at the start of it. The advanced wreck course in itself isn't a tech qualification. If the reason you want tech training is because you think a tech qual is a pre-requisite for the advanced wreck course then this is incorrect. Just do the adv wreck course without the expense of tech training; goes back to my point about identifying the type of diving you want to do first, then train for it.

    These links provide a useful overview of some agencies and courses - www.mikepottsdiving.co.uk/divetechcourses.html My training is with Steve Hills of 2Dive4 at Stansted - this link gives more details - http://www.2dive4.co.uk/courses_tdi.php This site gives some useful flowcharts of tech quals against depth - http://www.tekstremediving.com/tdi_courses.php Might help you to list the purpose of each course and identify the closest to what you want.

    As mentioned though, good instructors are crucial but I would say be certain about the type of diving you want to do first, then train for it, otherwise it could work out more expensive than necessary.

    Apologies if any of this seems to be teaching you to suck eggs, only sent this post to help offer some focus.[hr]
    Sounds like some sort of diving disorder :)
     
  5. Suggsy

    Suggsy Banned

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    As an aside, Major, TDI now do an entry level trimix like IANTD and it only costs £20 more than an & dp.

    To the op, I have done IANTD and TDI and can definitely state its the instructor who makes the difference to how the course is ran. With GUE I believe all instructors to sing from the same hymn sheet, which, depending on your point of view, can also be a good thing.
     
  6. Major Clanger

    Major Clanger P-Plated Meg Diver

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    Did look at it and was tempted but put off by relatively few times will use trimix vs cost of gas, new computer etc at this stage, plus the adv nitrox/deco course is a pre-requisite with TDI but not with IANTD but are limited to 15 mins deco.

    Absolutely. What appealed to me about my instructor was his ability to communicate well, openness to different viewpoints, philosophies and configurations and good "blokeishness".
     
  7. salty_scuba_peanut

    salty_scuba_peanut New Member

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    I didn't realise that TDI DP had no limits on the decompression. Interesting.
     
  8. ashsg79

    ashsg79 New Member

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    Try having a word with Andy Boyle at ccrspares.co.uk he teaches all levels of tech with many different organisations. he teaches OC and CCR and basically what he does'nt know about diving is not worth knowing. Give him a call for a chat he will give you some good advise on which route to take. Good luck
     
  9. Suggsy

    Suggsy Banned

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    Im not sure if you missed the bit where I said it only costs £20 more, for that amount I'd rather do it, then at least you have the option. I guess the question for you to answer in that regard is, what is your personal narcotic depth? Mine is 30-35m, conditions dependant. Oh and whether you believe O2 to be narcotic.

    You don't need a trimix puter either, plan the dive, dive the plan etc. Especially so for UK wreck diving which are predominantly square profiles.[hr]
    Its not a prerequisite either, Im talking about the Helitrox course btw.
     
  10. Silty Bottom

    Silty Bottom in DIRnial

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    Speak to Air Guzzler, he's recently completed Adv Rec Trimix with Andy Boyle and had a lot of good things to say about him
     
  11. Major Clanger

    Major Clanger P-Plated Meg Diver

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    Nope, didn't miss it. Like I said, to do the TDI trimix course you have to have done the adv nitrox/deco course beforehand, so a bit more than £20 difference. AN/DC isn't a pre-requisite for IANTD Trimix but it wasn't a course for me because of other reasons. I hope to do trimix in the future but not just yet. Point taken bout the puter but overall not for me at the mo'.
     
  12. Suggsy

    Suggsy Banned

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    You're not reading my post major. Helitrox, look it up as im getting tired repeating myself.
     
  13. Major Clanger

    Major Clanger P-Plated Meg Diver

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    You smoking something, your post referred to entry level trimix so get tired, I'm bored with this. Your words: "TDI now do an entry level trimix like IANTD and it only costs £20 more than an & dp"

    TDI Entry Level Trimix £519
    Pre-requisites
    TDI Advanced Nitrox & Decompression Procedures Certification (or equivalent)
    Minimum age: 18
    Show proof of 100 logged open water dives, 30 deeper than 30 metres
     
  14. Suggsy

    Suggsy Banned

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    Did you look up helitrox? No.
    Sorry about posting a link to YD, but if someone else states what I have the penny might drop. In the meantime, im off for a virtual smoke!


    http://www.yorkshire-divers.com/forums/tek-talk/113819-tdi-launches-helitrox-course.html
     
  15. Major Clanger

    Major Clanger P-Plated Meg Diver

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    Since when is the entry Trimix level course the same as the Helitrox course. If these are the same courses then if it's called entry trimix an/dc is still a pre-requisite. Did I look it up, yes once you said helitrox (eventually). I'll light the stuff for you. The helitrox cse appears to be a completely different course to the trimix course you originally said was £20 more than the one I'm doing and you still need to do the advance nitrox course if I read it correctly. Either way, it's not what I wanted and more expensive overall. Ucks sake, where's the crystal ball. I'm sure you meant well.
     
  16. salty_scuba_peanut

    salty_scuba_peanut New Member

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    Snorkels at 20 paces?
     
  17. Razza

    Razza Member

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    All this hostility and it's not even a GUE course we are discussing!
     
  18. Major Clanger

    Major Clanger P-Plated Meg Diver

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    10 and my training to use them was extensive. Did you mean snorkels or something else. Only ask to clarify you dont mean something completely different. Joined this thread trying to be helpful, now look what's happened. :)
     
  19. salty_scuba_peanut

    salty_scuba_peanut New Member

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    :lol:

    I meant snorkels :confused:
     
  20. Major Clanger

    Major Clanger P-Plated Meg Diver

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    I know my friend, just entering in to the spirit of creating confusion. Be grateful I didn't then jump down your throat for not understanding :) :) :)
     

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